Athens
, 10 November 2009
Mr. Paikos: Let’s go to Berlin. Alternate Foreign Minister Droutsas, who is in Berlin with the Prime Minister, is with us.
Greeting’s Mr. Minister.
Mr. Droutsas: Good morning Mr. Paikos, good morning Mr. Kottakis, and good morning to your listeners, as well.
Mr. Kottakis: Mr. Droutsas, yesterday the Prime Minister, Mr. Papandreou, drew an apt parallel between the fall of the Berlin Wall and the fall of the last wall still standing in the European Union: the wall in Cyprus.
The question is, December looms before us and the Turks have yet to implement the Customs Union protocol and open their ports and airports to Cypriot ships and planes.
For us, is implementation of the Protocol a sine qua non condition – their opening them – for the continuation of Turkey’s accession course in the future.
Mr. Droutsas: As you rightly said, the Prime Minister and I are here in Berlin to participate in the celebrations marking the 20th anniversary of the fall of the Berlin Wall. This was also a good opportunity for us to shout once again that there is no place for walls in our European family, there is no place for occupation forces, and of course we are referring to Cyprus.
With regard to December, as you said, we have stressed repeatedly that the December European Council will evaluate Turkey, will evaluate what Turkey has done to date to implement the obligations it has undertaken as a candidate country for EU membership. Specific obligations to the European Union and all its member states.
Mr. Paikos: Yes. The question is, what will we do? The European Council will evaluate. What will we do?
Mr. Droutsas: As you stated, there are also the obligations Turkey has under the Protocol, the Protocol for the implementation of the customs union with Cyprus. Of course, this too is one of the important criteria based on which Turkey will be evaluated in December at the European Council, by the European Union and its member states.
Mr. Kottakis: It is one, because a three-year extension has been given for the implementation of this Protocol, and the Turks haven’t implemented it. Things have come to a head.
Mr. Paikos: Would our side accept a new extension for the implementation of the Protocol from December on?
Mr. Droutsas: Look, as I said before, the December European Council is an important date for Turkey’s evaluation, particularly with regard to the issue of the implementation of the Customs Union Protocol; the implantation of the Customs Union with Cyprus, the opening of airports to Cyprus.
Mr. Paikos: And the ports, yes.
Mr. Droutsas: Precisely. December is an important date. Turkey will be evaluated at that time, and I don’t think there is room for other thoughts or interpretations at this time.
Mr. Paikos: Not even an extension? Allow me to insist: Not even an extension? Because we know there are …
Mr. Droutsas: I insist, as well, that the December European Council will evaluate Turkey according to criteria that are objective as well as strict.
Mr. Kottakis: You are absolutely right. In the run-up to the elections, we read about the Prime Minister’s thoughts: that he would like to pick up the thread of Greek-Turkish relations where he left it, and, if possible, go to a Helsinki 2, which means what? That Turkey might be evaluated on how it conducted itself towards us based on European texts, good neighbourly relations, Halki, the Patriarchate, etc., and for a new roadmap to be found.
Are we going in that direction? A roadmap that includes even the final referral of all our disputes to the International Court in The Hague. Are we, Mr. Droutsas, heading in such a direction – the government, you, Mr. Papandreou?
Mr. Droutsas: Because the term roadmap has been misinterpreted at times by certain sides, we will not use that term. But I want to stress this: We started Turkey’s European course in 1999 with the familiar Helsinki decisions, the thinking being that through this European course, Turkey will be forced to make the necessary reforms in its country and fully respect the issues that immediately concern Greece and Cyprus.
Mr. Paikos: The bilateral issues. Right.
Mr. Droutsas: It is our view that in recent years this pressure that Turkey felt from the European Union has slackened, and it is precisely this pressure that we want to create again on the part of the European Union, so that …
Mr. Paikos: To reinvigorate it. Right.
Mr. Droutsas: So that Turkey has to carry out – with great resolve and at a fast pace – the reforms that are needed, on its own issues, as well. That is the philosophy.
Mr. Paikos: Meanwhile, Erdogan is coming in December. Are preparations being made such that we might hope, we might see some tangible results following this meeting with the Prime Minister?
Mr. Droutsas: I think you know something I don’t. I don’t know anything about Mr. Erdogan’s coming.
Mr. Kottakis: There is no way we could know, Mr. Droutsas.
Mr. Droutsas: I don’t know anything about Mr. Erdogan’s coming to Greece. I stress once again that on the occasion of Mr. Papandreou’s visit to Istanbul, there was a first meeting with his Turkish counterpart.
Mr. Paikos: Yes. Yes, that. And there was also the letter, etc.
Mr. Droutsas: Mr. Erdogan responded positively and in writing, sending a message that he would like to continue these contacts. He expressed his will for a new meeting with Mr. Papandreou, whenever that is deemed appropriate by both sides.
Mr. Paikos: Yes, it’s just that the report said something about before …
Mr. Droutsas: No, no. Once again, I think you know something that I don’t. There is no date. I want to clarify this and close the matter. There is the expression of will from both sides to continue the contacts and to continue on this constructive path that we started.
Mr. Kottakis: As you mentioned dates, …
Mr. Droutsas: Clear statements and clear positions – always.
Mr. Kottakis: Clear statements, right. Yesterday, Mr. Droutsas, the Prime Minister met with the U.S. Secretary of State, Ms. Clinton. I would like to ask you this: First, what was the climate like? And second – as we are on the subject of dates – whether it can be confirmed that Ms. Clinton will be coming to Athens in early December to participate in the OSCE Ministerial.
Mr. Droutsas: First, let me stress that yesterday’s meeting took place in a particularly good and warm climate. They are well acquainted from the past – we all know each other very well – and it was a good opportunity for us. We made the most of this meeting, I think, to set out the tone of the foreign policy the new government will be exercising. A new, dynamic foreign policy of initiatives.
We capitalize on the opportunities given to us and create opportunities we can use for our own interests. Yesterday’s chat was precisely in this direction, in a very warm, good climate. We gave our ground position. We said that we – Greece – have once again taken firm hold of the steering wheel on issues that concern our immediate region.
Mr. Paikos: One would expect…
Mr. Droutsas: Now with regard… I’m sorry?
Mr. Kottakis: Regarding Ms. Clinton’s visit, yes.
Mr. Droutsas: With regard to Ms. Clinton’s visit on the occasion of the Ministerial Council of the OSCE at the beginning of December in Athens, we have received positive messages from Ms. Clinton too, as well as from all the Foreign Ministers of the 56 OSCE participating states. We expect a full house in Athens at the beginning of December.
Mr. Kottakis: Just don’t jinx it, Mr. Droutsas, because last time she was scheduled to come, she fell and broke her leg.
Mr. Droutsas: Yes, touch wood for something like that not to happen.
Mr. Paikos: Mr. Minister, what sense do you get about raising matters that are of concern to us with Ms. Clinton; what feeling do you have regarding the response you’ll get? I’m saying this because we all know the pressures put on us in Bucharest regarding FYROM and its relationship with NATO. Do we know if we will be pressured again perhaps from the same side, do you have anything, any indications from that side?
Mr. Droutsas: In yesterday’s talks, as I said earlier, we did not sense any kind of pressure for the simple reason that everyone now understands and they have realized that the new Greek government is exercising a foreign policy of initiatives, as I said earlier, with tangible proof already.
The Prime Minister’s visit to Cyprus, his visit to Istanbul, the first short, informal, introductory meeting with Prime Minister Gruevski upon our own initiative – all these are part of a policy of initiatives, always aimed at, and I stress that…
Mr. Paikos: A policy of mobility in any event.
Mr. Droutsas: … I stress this, aimed at Greece taking the steering wheel again on issues that are of immediate concern to us. This is our objective and I think that in this government’s first 3-4 weeks, we have already taken some first steps in the right direction.
Mr. Paikos: Your efforts are serious. Mr. Droutsas..
Mr. Droutsas: Let me stress this once again, if you allow me, so that there are no misunderstandings here either. Greece’s positions on all the matters that are of concern to us are clear and well known to everyone. These positions do not change. What changes is the way in which we address matters, in order to achieve precisely …
Mr. Paikos: The way in which we claim, we claim.
Mr. D. Droutsas: Claim these positions precisely, get them through and implement them.
Mr. Paikos: Mr. Minister, thank you very much. Have a safe trip back. Good day.
Mr. Kottakis: Good day.