JOURNALIST: Minister, remarkable changes have occurred in foreign policy lately. Firstly, we witnessed the shift in Haftar’s stance. Then, Türkiye’s insistence on participating in SAFE. We also have the U.S. Ambassador to Türkiye praising Erdogan and making promises about the F-35s. What changed? Did we do something wrong to reach this point? And let’s not, of course, forget the issue of Sinai.
G. GERAPETRITIS: With all due respect, I do not believe anything has changed. I do not believe there have been failures. On the contrary, Greek diplomacy always does what is best for the homeland. Regarding the SAFE program, it is clear that the European Union is moving towards a more geopolitical direction. This naturally means that European defense must be strengthened. After all, the Greek Prime Minister was one of the first to highlight the importance of defense in the EU’s path towards strategic autonomy. In this context, the EU has decided to open its market to third countries - candidates or third countries, such as the United States and the United Kingdom. However, this is not carried out in a holistic and horizontal manner. The SAFE Regulation defines the procedures and the participants of a specific, four-year European program with a total of €150 billion. In light of the Regulation’s entry into force, Greek diplomacy effectively fulfilled its role.
JOURNALIST: That means majority voting instead of consensus?
G. GERAPETRITIS: The SAFE Regulation, according to the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union, can be adopted by qualified majority, i.e. minimum 15 out of 27 member states, representing 65% of the EU’s total population. Therefore, Greece, like any other EU country, does not have veto power. Therefore, the narrative that Greece failed to block Türkiye is, at best, a misunderstanding and, at worst, political opportunism. It is also completely inaccurate that Greece did not maintain a firm stance during the voting of the Regulation. The reality is that the vast majority of EU member states favor a more open defense market to encourage competition and ultimately lower defense procurement costs. Nevertheless, we managed to secure two key amendments that are crucial for Greece. The first one, which we requested and ultimately imposed, was that third countries are not automatically included in the defense programs. In order for third countries to be eligible, a bilateral agreement between the EU and the third country must first be concluded. And this agreement requires unanimity.
The second amendment we achieved is an explicit reference that, in these bilateral agreements, whenever they are concluded in the future, national security concerns of the member states have to be taken into account. If a member state deems that such concerns are in place, it can exercise its veto power. Therefore, in negotiating a Regulation that could - due to the qualified majority procedure - include third countries in defense programs automatically and unconditionally, we effectively established a veto right and placed national interests at the forefront for all EU member states. Anyone who believes the negotiation was not beneficial to our country should reconsider.
JOURNALIST: Do you ultimately consider the SAFE Regulation to be a means of indirect access and that it should change?
G. GERAPETRITIS: In the context of achieving strategic autonomy, the EU chose to open its defense market to third countries for a limited subset of the program’s budget. What matters to us is that Greece holds the keys to that door and protects our national interests. That is indeed the case here. Let’s not forget that, Cyprus, whose concerns are similar to ours, also voted in favor of the SAFE Regulation.
JOURNALIST: Now let us turn to Libya and Haftar. Isn’t his shift in stance a defeat for Greek diplomacy? Especially considering that we are offering him a ship. A whole ship. We’re even training Libyan coast guards here. Are you aware of that?
G. GERAPETRITIS: The situation in Libya is extremely difficult. The long-standing external influence and the de facto division of the country create conditions of great instability. Greece is doing everything necessary to promote both regional stability and its own national interests. Greece has substantial national interests related to Libya, such as the delimitation of maritime zones and illegal migration. Given the current situation, especially in Sub-Saharan Africa and the Middle East, there is a significant risk that migration flows rapidly increase. We are already seeing a notable increase in the Southern Route.
JOURNALIST: Why do you think Haftar is doing this? What’s the reason for his sudden outreach to Türkiye? Why didn’t we act sooner when he contacted the Turkish Defense Minister?
G. GERAPETRITIS: First of all, we should not rush to conclusions. Greece is monitoring developments and working to establish a network of contacts and engage in substantive diplomacy with both eastern and western Libya. We believe that a balanced, mutually beneficial communication channel, which, for historical reasons, has become obsolete, should be restored with both sides. To enable direct diplomatic channels, we reopened our Embassy in Tripoli and our Consulate General in Benghazi. We are taking initiatives and insist at international fora that Libya must be supported in developing a national reconciliation program under its full ownership.
JOURNALIST: Have you had any discussions with Haftar or others in eastern Libya following these developments?
G. GERAPETRITIS: We have established multiple diplomatic channels based on a comprehensive geopolitical plan. I would like to emphasize the importance of the presence of two American energy giants, Exxon and Chevron, in our wider region, for our sovereign rights. Libya itself, when it allocated its own maritime blocks for exploitation, respected the median line. None of this is accidental. The so-called Turkish-Libyan memorandum, signed in 2019 and submitted to the UN in 2020, is null and void. It obviously does not produce any legal effects primarily because Türkiye and Libya do not have opposite coasts, as stipulated by the Law of the Sea. Therefore, it cannot be legitimized.
JOURNALIST: Still, Minister, Haftar visited Greece, he addressed the Hellenic Parliament, he assured us about the Turkish-Libyan memorandum and about his support even on the issue of maritime zones.
G. GERAPETRITIS: At this moment, the only thing that exists is a proposal for the establishment of a committee to assess the Turkish-Libyan memorandum. Please have confidence in Greek diplomacy that it is undertaking all necessary efforts. And we must bear in mind that, especially in Libya, our diplomacy should be especially prudent and balanced. We remain vigilant and have strong tools at our disposal, which we will use if needed.
JOURNALIST: So, do you see yourself visiting Libya soon?
G. GERAPETRITIS: Yes, I will visit both sides of Libya in the very near future.
JOURNALIST: Let’s move on to Sinai. What happened there? Despite public reassurances on camera and privately with the Prime Minister, there is now a court ruling that overturns the ownership status at least. From what we understand, the religious status remains unchanged for the time being. I am not sure what will happen with the monks’ visas, but what about the ownership status? Why did your visit and the agreement you reached with your counterpart not put an end to the matter? What went wrong?
G. GERAPETRITIS: Let us set the record straight, because I fear unrelated issues have been conflated. Saint Catherine’s Monastery on Mount Sinai is a Monastery with enormous historical significance for the Orthodox faith, dating back to the 6th century A.D. That means it has operated continuously for over 1.500 years and is a UNESCO World Heritage Site with immense religious and sentimental value. Issues regarding its character and property rights date back decades, if not centuries. The legal dispute also didn’t arise recently - it is pending for over a decade. So, we are not dealing with something new here. There was an effort to resolve the dispute extrajudicially, so that the litigation would cease and the Monastery could continue functioning as it always had. The agreement would have ended the legal dispute, but it would not have permanently secured the religious status of the Monastery.
JOURNALIST: Do you mean its religious function? If I am not mistaken, the current issue concerns the ownership, no one is disputing the religious aspect.
G. GERAPETRITIS: Under Egyptian law, there is no special provision for the Holy Monastery, despite its centuries-long religious role. The Court of Appeal’s ruling contains both positive and negative elements. On the positive side, the Greek Orthodox religious character is permanently safeguarded. We should not underestimate this since, regardless of the ownership status, a sovereign state always has the power to intervene. Therefore, following this ruling - the first one in the Monastery’s 15-century history - its religious and Greek Orthodox character is officially recognized by Egypt and will remain unchanged in the future.
JOURNALIST: I have visited the Monastery and it truly fills one with pride to see the Greek flag in Sinai.
G. GERAPETRITIS: The Greek flag will continue to fly, I assure you of that. The negative aspect of the ruling is that ownership was not granted to the Monastery.
JOURNALIST: Is there a risk that the supply of goods to the Monastery be terminated or disrupted?
G. GERAPETRITIS: There is absolutely no risk to the Monastery’s financial survival. The risk lies primarily in aspects of continuity, as regards the monks. What must be ensured is that those residing in the Monastery will continue to carry out their monastic duties unhindered and that their presence will be renewed. Greece will ensure this. In fact, the decision by the Egyptian Court of Appeal has provided us with a powerful tool to maintain that continuity. Greece will never abandon the Monastery. I am in constant contact with the Hegoumen of the Holy Monastery of Saint Catherine and the monks, so I am aware of their position on these matters. It goes without saying that Greece will never take a decision without consulting those primarily concerned, because they are the ones living in the Holy Monastery. I also had the opportunity to communicate with the Ecumenical Patriarch on these matters.
And I would like to add one more thing. Some are criticizing the government today, even though no resolution regarding ownership or the continuity of the Monastery had been reached during the last 15 centuries. The monks at the Monastery have always been granted short-term residence permits, without Egyptian citizenship, at the risk that the Monastery might one day be empty. Suddenly, they come forward hypocritically to blame the government for something that has remained unresolved for centuries – it hasn’t been resolved, not even by those who held political power in the past.
JOURNALIST: Are there currently twenty monks? Is there a chance that this number will increase as a result of this decision, of the agreement you made?
G. GERAPETRITIS: On the very day the court decision was published, the Presidency and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs issued separate statements - which is unusual since these institutions do not typically comment on judicial rulings - underlining that they will fully safeguard the Monastery’s status quo. And if you noticed the statement issued yesterday by my Egyptian counterpart following our meeting, it is extremely clear. It explicitly states: “The status quo of the Monastery is fully safeguarded”. What does status quo mean? It refers to the situation that existed prior to the ruling. Therefore, all rights emanating from the Monastery's cultural heritage, which is also protected by UNESCO, remain intact. Furthermore, I will intensify my efforts in the immediate future in order to reach an agreement with the Egyptian side that will resolve issues dating back centuries. Because our position is that problems should not be perpetuated while we are simply waiting for our term in office to end. We address the problems at their source, even if that sometimes comes at a cost. But I assure you that, with the Egyptian side’s good will - and fully respecting the laws of a friendly country - I will do everything possible so that we achieve an agreement that will ensure two main things: the legal status and the continuity of the Monastery.
JOURNALIST: You are optimistic then. When can we expect the next step, Minister?
G. GERAPETRITIS: We have agreed to examine each other's proposals. We calculate on exchanging of documents in June, so that discussions can advance in a meaningful way. I am convinced that, in the context of Greek-Egyptian relations, which have been upgraded to a strategic level, the Monastery will remain a magnificent religious symbol, as it has always been.
JOURNALIST: Egypt is a powerful ally, yet it had been a complex one in all negotiations. The negotiations we conducted with the Egyptians have not been easy. How can you be optimistic that this time they will be carried out smoothly? I am especially referring to the delimitation of maritime zones.
G. GERAPETRITIS: Difficulties may arise in every discussion. I am a deliberative person. I believe that one should respect the position of their interlocutor, especially when this position is based on the sovereignty of a state. This the case with the position of the Egyptian side which pertains to the antiquities within its territory and the court decisions that have been issued. However, during my brief stay in Cairo, I had the opportunity to confirm our mutual will to maintain the high level of our relations for the benefit of our countries and regional security.
JOURNALIST: You are the only Minister of Foreign Affairs of the post-dictatorship era who has met so many times with his Turkish counterpart. It is something we have never witnessed since 1974.
G. GERAPETRITIS: I am sure you are following this issue closely, so I will take your word for it.
JOURNALIST: What do you discuss during these meetings? I am curious because every time a meeting takes place, there is always a brief announcement that you discussed international developments and the date of the upcoming High-Level Cooperation Council. What do you talk about during all those long meetings with Fidan? I think the public should know. According to your own words, there is no secret diplomacy. What do you discuss during these meetings?
G. GERAPETRITIS: Would you consider it appropriate to disclose all the details of discussions held at the highest diplomatic level, all the more when they concern the security of the country? Should we discuss these matters live on air?
JOURNALIST: No. But this is no reason to issue the same announcement every time.
G. GERAPETRITIS: At the moment, it is not just about Greece and Türkiye. It is not just about the bilateral issues. There are also regional ones with significant spillover effects for both countries. The crisis in the Middle East concerns us both, the war in Ukraine affects us all. The important conflicts in Africa pose a potential existential threat to the Mediterranean Region and to Europe. So, I can assure you that there are many issues on the table. On the other hand, choosing to have a channel of communication, periodically, at the highest level, has one sole purpose: to prevent and manage tensions. There have been potential sources of tension, such as the migration issue, which, thanks to our direct channels, have not escalated into crises.
I am often asked, “what do you discuss?” And in any case, what is the point of discussing if Türkiye does not back down from its basic positions? The answer is very simple. We did not expect Türkiye to back down from its basic positions. Just as there is no chance that Greece will back down from its own. With this in mind, what we are trying to do is establish a functional relationship and a basic level of mutual trust. Because we tend to forget where we were three, five or ten years ago. Let us remember that several years ago we had tens of thousands of irregular migrants flooding the islands and Evros. Today, by contrast, thanks to the improved relations, Turkish tourists and their families are peacefully visiting our islands, significantly boosting our local economies and, above all, creating a spirit of mutual understanding between the two peoples.
JOURNALIST: Let's move on to the islands. The residents, and especially the mayors of the islands, are extremely enthusiastic about this measure, and, I imagine, you are receiving a lot of requests to extend it to more islands. Despite the fact that your own island, Karpathos, is not included, since, as far as I know, it lacks the necessary infrastructure. Later, I will move on to the airspace violations, because I have some questions about that.
G. GERAPETRITIS: Of course. As far as the fast-track visa policy is concerned, it was an idea I worked on...
JOURNALIST: It was an excellent idea by the way. It was the best thing ever done regarding Greek-Turkish relations.
G. GERAPETRITIS: Thank you very much. I worked on this idea on the basis of an older similar but extremely short-lived program, during the UN General Assembly in September 2023 in New York, just two months after assuming office. There, I met with the EU Commissioner for Home Affairs, Ylva Johansson, who immediately embraced the idea.
JOURNALIST: Despite the fact that she was incredibly critical regarding the Pylos shipwreck.
G. GERAPETRITIS: Although she had indeed expressed certain objections regarding the protection of our maritime borders, she immediately endorsed the initiative. I ought to say that, despite the fact that it constitutes a deviation from the Schengen rules, albeit a legitimate one, she took steps to ensure that we could proceed. Apart from boosting local economies and the islands' income, I believe it is extremely important to develop people-to-people diplomacy between our two countries.
JOURNALIST: We have paved the way for the whole European Union with this measure.
G. GERAPETRITIS: Indeed, there has been universal approval. In its first year of implementation, the measure included 10 islands. According to the selection criteria, the five islands with migrant accommodation facilities and the five islands with direct ferry connections to the Turkish coast were eligible. I always strive to be objective as far as the selection criteria are concerned. This year we added two more islands, Patmos and Samothrace. Ferry connections were again used as the main criterion. Unfortunately, due to the exceptional nature of the measure in relation to European Union Law, it was impossible to extend it further.
JOURNALIST: Minister, for quite some time now, two types of Turkish reconnaissance helicopters and one UAV have been taking off from the Turkish coast almost daily, including on public and religious holidays. Without a flight plan, which means that they violate air traffic rules or the 10 miles of our airspace, they fly between Rhodes and Karpathos. They stay there for a short time. We do not know what they are doing. That happens every day. Have you ever asked Fidan about it? What are you doing there? What are you looking for?
G. GERAPETRITIS: First of all, I would like to put things into perspective. Some years ago, we had 7.000 airspace violations per year. Today...
JOURNALIST: We have three airspace violations daily.
G. GERAPETRITIS: We only have a few cases. Most of the time in the last two years we have had none. Let's look at the figures. Firstly, from 7.000 violations per year until 2023, we observe that the figures have dropped dramatically. Secondly, Greece continues to fully conduct its military exercises in the Aegean Sea. It is part of the Confidence-Building Measures developed by our country within the framework of the Greek-Turkish dialogue with the participation of military staff under the supervision of a senior diplomat. So, the issues you are referring to are being addressed in the Confidence-Building Measures and the relevant discussion underway. We are obviously aware of the situation. Obviously, we are taking and implementing all the necessary steps. And we are making sure to upgrade our defense capabilities so that we can neutralize any potential threat. As I often say, we seek peace and prosperity. Greeks are, by principle, peaceful people. On the other hand, in order to secure peace, one must always be vigilant. Especially in a time of global asymmetries. Therefore, we will continue to upgrade our defense capabilities, strengthen our diplomatic footprint and grow our economy.
JOURNALIST: Two final questions, Minister. You said that we are not backing down from our national interests. What happened with the cable? Did we back down?
G. GERAPETRITIS: I have repeatedly stated that we absolutely did not back down. I am aware that there is distrust. And, unfortunately, there are professional demagogues who constantly try to stir up people's emotions. The site survey which was conducted near Kasos last summer, was completed according to the company's schedule. Indeed, Turkish warships appeared, as they should not have. We understand that Türkiye considers the Turkish-Libyan memorandum to be in force and producing legal effects. I will be clear. First of all, this memorandum is null and void. Secondly, this is about a maritime research for laying electric cables, which is fully protected by International Law. Since we all state that we want to have International Law as our basis of understanding, we cannot do so on a selective basis. Greece has made a conscious commitment to International Law.
The Crete-Cyprus electricity interconnection will continue. I can assure you that will happen in due time. Exactly as it has been the case with the Maritime Spatial Planning, which was pending for years. It was submitted by this government about a month ago. It outlines the outer potential limits of the Greek continental shelf and Exclusive Economic Zone, and explicitly states Greece's right to extend its territorial waters to 12 nautical miles, something that is being recorded in an international instrument for the first time. Obviously, anyone can voice criticism, regardless of how hypocritical this may be. We brought Chevron, which reflected high confidence in our sovereign rights. Greece will continue to exercise its sovereign rights on the field. We seek consensus. Our wish is to delimit maritime zones with all neighboring countries – including with Libya and Türkiye. We have clearly stated that we would like to refer the delimitation of the Exclusive Economic Zone and continental shelf with Türkiye to the Hague. Those who have International Law on their side have nothing to fear.
JOURNALIST: Minister, when do you believe that the laying of the cable will resume? What is your assessment? You told me when it best suits our interests.
G. GERAPETRITIS: The timing depends on the company's planning and the issuance of the required NAVTEX, which must be issued in stages since we are dealing with a vast maritime area that cannot be fully restricted to commercial traffic. There are many factors to be taken into consideration. The right timing will come and it will come soon.
JOURNALIST: Mr. Gerapetritis, do you have any good news to share following your meeting with María Ángela Holguín?
G. GERAPETRITIS: Indeed, on Thursday, I welcomed to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs María Ángela Holguín, the UN Secretary-General’s Personal Envoy on Cyprus. We had a productive meeting. Over the past two years, there have been significant developments in the Cyprus Issue, to which the improvement of Greek-Turkish relations has clearly contributed. It is important to maintain this positive momentum. This is also the will of the UN Secretary-General, António Guterres. The informal meeting on Cyprus in a broader format, convened in March after seven years of inaction, produced tangible results, which was the objective set by the Secretary-General himself. Of course, it is important that what has been agreed upon is implemented because the primary goal is to build trust. On this basis, we are preparing for the next informal meeting in a broader format, in which Greece will play the same constructive role as it did in Geneva. The fact that the UN Secretary-General has appointed a Personal Envoy on Cyprus demonstrates two things. Firstly, that the Cyprus Issue is high on the UN's agenda and, secondly, that progress comes only through dialogue.
JOURNALIST: How many Ministers of Foreign Affairs do you think there are in the country?
G. GERAPETRITIS: Needless to say, one.
JOURNALIST: Thank you.
G. GERAPETRITIS: Thank you.
June 7, 2025