G. AFTIAS: The Minister of Foreign Affairs, Mr. Dendias. Good morning, Minister.
N. DENDIAS: Good morning to you and your viewers.
G. AFTIAS: Good morning and thank you. Minister, what’s happening in Evros? Look, you and the Minister of Defence, you’re here today and a statement was issued yesterday by the Ministry of Defence. What’s actually happening in Evros? Has Greek territory really been occupied?
N. DENDIAS: Mr. Aftias, I’ll explain what has happened very briefly. This is what has happened: Greece started preparatory work – taking measurements, actually – for the construction and extension of the fence in Evros.
G. AFTIAS: Right.
N. DENDIAS: Turkey delivered a note to us, asking to be notified in advance of the coordinates at which this fence, this project, would be constructed. Greece rightly refused this request. We told the Turks that the fence is being constructed exclusively on Greek territory and, consequently, we have no reason to notify them of anything. We then saw movement on the Turkish side, at a point where preparatory work had been carried out for the construction of this fence. Following this, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs sent a second note to the Turkish Ambassador here, demanding that there not be the slightest Turkish action on this. That is the reality of the situation as far as territory is concerned.
But this brings us to another unpleasant reality that has nothing to do with ...
G. AFTIAS: Just a second. When we say “movement,” as reported by the British newspapers ...
N. DENDIAS: That’s exactly what I was coming to.
G. AFTIAS: Did we have Turks – as the British newspapers are saying – 15 policemen and 10 Turkish military personnel, pass onto Greek territory? Is this true?
N. DENDIAS: That’s what I’m coming to now, Mr. Aftias. The English daily “The Sun” took up the claim that Turks occupied 1.6 hectares of Greek territory. And what’s worse, this completely false claim was adopted, first of all, by the Greek extreme-right party, which repeated it, converting it into a topic of Greek public debate, through various persons on various television media. And Syriza went even further than this nonsense, announcing, in the form of a supposed question for me, asking whether the Greek Army retreated from Greek territory in the face of the Turkish military police. Mr. Aftias, we don't play around with such things. Nor am I prepared to put the major issues of Greek foreign policy at the mercy of petty political interests. National interest cannot be toyed with because of the existential concerns of every extreme-right party or the polling concerns of the opposition parties. We need to be prudent and stop this nonsense here.
G. AFTIAS: A question, Minister: Who heads up diplomacy for Syriza?
N. DENDIAS: This concerns Syriza. Syriza has a leader. We asked specifically – since you asked me – who signed this preposterous question.
G. AFTIAS: Who signed it?
N. DENDIAS: Our question wasn’t answered. Because when it was submitted, the answer was the Press Office. The Press Office has no specific identity. So, we asked Syriza, “Who signed this preposterous press release, this preposterous question? Who is politically responsible for asking our country whether the Greek Army retreated from the Turkish” – and this is how they put it – “military police?” The absurdity knows no bounds. I repeat: Over the last year, as a political system, we have succeeded in supporting the national effort. We cannot jeopardise our national interest in order to score petty political points domestically. These are clearly critical times. I have repeatedly discussed this personally with the competent officials of the parties, in the context of the National Council on Foreign Policy and in the context of the Parliamentary Standing Committee on Defense and Foreign Affairs, with which I will be meeting again on Tuesday, together with Mr. Panagiotopoulos. Greece's national interests cannot in any way be toyed with to further petty party interests. We have paid for this sort of thing repeatedly in our history. From 1997 on we have paid dearly for petty party-politics nonsense. We cannot allow this.
G. AFTIAS: Greece – Greeks everywhere, if you will – felt a certain self-confidence, Minister. Greeks believed that Greece had a strong line in Evros. I ask the Minister of Foreign Affairs of my homeland: Is the resolve we showed on Clean Monday, when we didn’t allow even a mosquito to cross the border, the same, Minister?
N. DENDIAS: Mr. Aftias, no Greek Government – and I want to be clear on this – has ever allowed the loss of Greek territory. No government can, in any case. It is our constitutional duty to defend our national territory. There is a specific article in the Constitution, article 27, which gives specific capacities to each Government. No Government has the constitutional right to cede even one square centimetre of territory. It is surprising, however, that they do their national duty as the government, but as opposition parties they are inclined towards nonsense of the kind we've heard in recent days about occupation of national territory by a foreign power.
G. AFTIAS: Did a Turk set foot on Greek territory, whether a soldier or ...
N. DENDIAS: There was a specific statement from the Defence Ministry yesterday, Mr. Aftias. Specific – 15 words at most – to put an end to the public nonsense. I repeat: national interests cannot become the object of petty political debate.
G. AFTIAS: And of course, our position is: we are going ahead with the fence, as planned.
N. DENDIAS: Obviously. Turkey has no control over Greece’s actions on our national territory. This is why we delivered the first note to Ankara, to tell them that we won't report to them on what we do on our own territory.
G. AFTIAS: Minister, let’s talk about tourism, because I’ve learned that tourism is overcoming the coronavirus, but it still has to deal with Erdogan, who is unfortunately provoking us. And I read Alexis Papachelas’s article today about the Turks in the Aegean, and he says, Minister: “Greece must avoid falling into a trap of escalating tensions right now – a trap Ankara is setting.” Ankara wants to escalate the situation in Evros and the Aegean.
N. DENDIAS: It is obvious from a number of incidents that the Turkish side is pursuing tension and possible militarisation of the tensions we see. Greece must not and will not fall into this trap. This is clear. We have made this clear to Turkey, just as we have made it clear to the Turks that they need to function as a modern country. This is the 21st century. The gunboat diplomacy of the 19th century is long gone.
G. AFTIAS: Clearly.
N. DENDIAS: This is clear from the way many states – states that, until recently, were not allies of Greece – are reacting to Turkey’s actions, Mr. Aftias. Last week – in addition to Greece and Cyprus – France, the UAE and Egypt, countries that, in principle, have no problem with Turkey, adopted a communique directly condemning Turkish actions ...
G. AFTIAS: Regarding Libya.
N. DENDIAS: This shows that we can have alliances and support against illegality. It is in Turkey's interest to function as a modern country, to abandon its gunboat policy and to enter into discussion with Greece in the necessary spirit of the 21st century, within the framework of international law. International law governs discussions, and this resolves disputes in our century.
G. AFTIAS: Stay with us. After the break, I’ll ask you about tourism, because you take a lot of trips abroad. The Ministry of Foreign Affairs has enormous sway in this direction. We’ll wrap up our conversation. A break, and we’ll be back.
[…]
G. AFTIAS: As you can see, the tourist season has begun. As of tomorrow, you will be able to travel anywhere in our country. Things in the restaurant/café sector seem to be going better. We have our own people who will be telling us the “how” and “why.” And now I want to get a statement from the Minister on what his first trip abroad will be, with flights starting again. Come, Minister, to finish up our conversation, you are from Corfu, you love tourism.
N. DENDIAS: Mr. Aftias, a great effort has been made in the tourism sector. Because the tourism industry is a key sector of our economy. First of all, starting with the Prime Minister, who has held bilateral and multilateral meetings. The day before yesterday, he had a videoconference with Mr. Borisov, the President of Serbia, with the Prime Minister of Romania, in an effort to create a safe zone so that tourists from these countries can come to Greece. And he has had constant bilateral meetings. I and the Tourism Minister, as well as Mr. Karamanlis, are constantly talking with our colleagues in the effort to create common rules, safe channels. I underscore “safe,” so that foreign citizens can come to our country safely and our tourism market can start up.
This is an ongoing effort that I think will get results. We don't expect things to be ideal, but I think that the effort we are making is so great that we will see solid results from here on.
G. AFTIAS: Will you be visiting capitals to have more meetings, including some air travel?
N. DENDIAS: We’re waiting. Next week or early the week after, I will be going to Paris. On 5 June, the Italian Minister, Mr. Di Maio, is coming to Athens. I will be going to Tunisia, Egypt, the Emirates, Brussels, Vietnam, Indonesia. I think Argentina, after that, then all of the UN Security Council countries. Three months of trips have accrued while I’ve been here in Greece, and I have to make those trips in the space of a month or a month and a half.
G. AFTIAS: We wish the Minister of Foreign Affairs success.
N. DENDIAS: Thank you.
G. AFTIAS: Thank you very much.
N. DENDIAS: Thank you, Mr. Aftias. Goodbye.
May 24, 2020